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| Sue_2828 |
 Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:28 am Post subject: Queue Manager stays up |
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Apprentice
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 37
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Hello there, We are running MQ and message broker on an AIX system. We have one broker queue manager running. I noticed something that when we bring the message broker up , it will also starts the Queue manager. However, when the message broker comes down , the Queue manager stays up. Why so? . I need to make sure the queue manager comes down if the broker is down. Do I need to configure something ?
mqsistop q -- will bring both down broker and queue manager
mqsistop -- will bring broker only down.
but what happen when broker comes down unexpectedly?
Thanks
Sue |
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| mqjeff |
| Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 4:27 am Post subject: |
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Grand Master
Joined: 25 Jun 2008
Posts: 17447
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... It depends on what you mean by "the broker" and "unexpectedly".
If a single EG crashes, you don't *want* this to take down your queue manager, because then *all* of your EGs are down... And the bipbroker is gonna try and restart the downed EG anyway, so it would be counter productive to bring down the qmgr.
If the bipbroker process dies... again, you probably don't want to suffer an outage of your entire broker environment if all of your EGs are running correctly.
...
Thirdly, if a process in general dies unexpectedly, there may be nothing left that can take any action like stopping the qmgr.
All of that said, your monitoring tools should be able to notice whatever you consider sufficiently "ended" to require the qmgr being taken down, and then issue an endmqm. |
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| PeterPotkay |
| Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 6:12 am Post subject: Re: Queue Manager stays up |
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Poobah
Joined: 15 May 2001
Posts: 7722
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| Sue_2828 wrote: |
| I noticed something that when we bring the message broker up , it will also starts the Queue manager. However, when the message broker comes down , the Queue manager stays up. Why so? |
A Broker is useless without a QM.
A QM can be quite useful without a Broker.
| Sue_2828 wrote: |
| I need to make sure the queue manager comes down if the broker is down. |
Why?
_________________
Peter Potkay
Keep Calm and MQ On |
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| Sue_2828 |
| Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:54 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 37
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an application is pointing to this Queue Manager and if the queue manager is not up it will try to send the messages to another Queue Manager on a different server. Sort of a work around for High Availability solution since we are not using HACMP. Therefore, I was trying to see if there a configuration which I can do on AIX to force the queue manager down once the broker is down and useless? or that only can be done using HACMP?
Thanks |
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| PeterPotkay |
| Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:54 am Post subject: |
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Poobah
Joined: 15 May 2001
Posts: 7722
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| Sue_2828 wrote: |
| Sort of a work around for High Availability solution since we are not using HACMP. |
Sorta of lousy results, huh. They get what they pay for.
| Sue_2828 wrote: |
| Therefore, I was trying to see if there a configuration which I can do on AIX to force the queue manager down once the broker is down and useless? or that only can be done using HACMP? |
Look at the IC91 Support Pack and study the scripts included that determine the health of a Broker. Implement similiar scripts that shut your QM down when they determine the Broker is N/A. Good Luck, it will never be 100%. What if your Broker is up but your flow is down?
_________________
Peter Potkay
Keep Calm and MQ On |
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| fjb_saper |
| Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 18 Nov 2003
Posts: 20756
Location: LI,NY
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| Sue_2828 wrote: |
an application is pointing to this Queue Manager and if the queue manager is not up it will try to send the messages to another Queue Manager on a different server. Sort of a work around for High Availability solution since we are not using HACMP. Therefore, I was trying to see if there a configuration which I can do on AIX to force the queue manager down once the broker is down and useless? or that only can be done using HACMP?
Thanks |
Have you tried the command suspend qmgr cluster(xxx) ? 
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MQ & Broker admin |
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| Sue_2828 |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:32 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 37
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Have you tried the command suspend qmgr cluster(xxx) ?
We are not using MQ cluster ,, how would this command help me? |
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:45 am Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| Sue_2828 wrote: |
| We are not using MQ cluster ,, how would this command help me? |
I suspect my most worthy associate (at the risk of putting words in his mouth) was picking up on your earlier comment:
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| if the queue manager is not up it will try to send the messages to another Queue Manager on a different server |
Such things are commonly done using a cluster.
As you're not doing it this way, perhaps you could explain your method of redirecting messages? It might illuminate your situation further.
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Honesty is the best policy.
Insanity is the best defence. |
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| Sue_2828 |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:16 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 37
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| Datapower is the one being used for redirecting messages. We configure primary and secondary queue managers on the datapower and thats how if the primary queue manager is not up then messages will get redirect it to the secondary. The problem is with the broker being down, then the datapower will keep sending messages to the queue manager eventhough the broker is down. Thats the reason why , I want to force the queue manager down if the broker is down. |
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| exerk |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Jedi Council
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Posts: 6339
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Presumably DataPower is connecting via client? If so, rather than force down the queue manager, I suggest using PeterPotkay's method of detecting a failed Broker, and have it trigger a channel stop (faster than forcing down a queue manager).
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It's puzzling, I don't think I've ever seen anything quite like this before...and it's hard to soar like an eagle when you're surrounded by turkeys. |
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| Sue_2828 |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:05 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 37
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| I am looking at the scripts under IC91 and trying to figure which one I can edit to fit with the approach. |
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| harish_td |
| Posted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:39 am Post subject: |
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Master
Joined: 13 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
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DataPower is a client and hence once the listener to the queue manager is down, the device cannot send any messages to that queue manager. A slightly dirty trick would be to bring down your DataPower listener to the queue manager when you notice your broker is down.
The cleaner way of course is to trigger a SOMA request to DataPower every time the broker goes down to gracefuilly tell DataPower to stop sending messages to Queue Manager A and start sending messages to Queue Manager B. |
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