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| sumithar |
 Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:14 pm Post subject: CICS-batch-CICS: need for MQ |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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Question- I need to trigger a batch job from the CICS region and "pass" it some data.
I am triggering the job using the initiator facility available in CICS and planning to put the data I need to pass in a DB2 table the batch program can then read.
Is there any merit to using MQ in this equation at all? Any benefits to putting this data on an MQ instead of a DB2 table? I could even put it on a VSAM file right- and use the right share options that I can use it in a batch job which will run while CICS is up...
Likewise if I need to kick off a CICS tran from batch is there any benefit to having the batch program write to an MQ which is set up to trigger a CICS transaction as opposed to using the EXCI?
Thanks |
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| bruce2359 |
| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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Poobah
Joined: 05 Jan 2008
Posts: 9470
Location: US: west coast, almost. Otherwise, enroute.
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Another, perhaps simpler option, is to use the JES APIs from within your CICS application to open the JES queue and submit the JCL. Unless you have a specific need to involve MQ or DB2 or whatever...
_________________
I like deadlines. I like to wave as they pass by.
ב''ה
Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi, Lex Vivendi. As we Worship, So we Believe, So we Live. |
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| sumithar |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:16 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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| bruce2359 wrote: |
| Another, perhaps simpler option, is to use the JES APIs from within your CICS application to open the JES queue and submit the JCL. Unless you have a specific need to involve MQ or DB2 or whatever... |
I guess 'JES APIs from within your CICS' is what I was talking about when I said " the initiator facility available in CICS"!
And you don't see any need to use MQ to pass data to the batch job then, I might as well use VSAM or a DB2 table instead...
Any thoughts on the other way around? Triggering a CICS tran from w/in a batch job?
Thanks |
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| Mr Butcher |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 5:36 am Post subject: |
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Padawan
Joined: 23 May 2005
Posts: 1716
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if you already have batch triggering in place, you could use that, just put the data you would like to pass to the batch job to mq queue, use batchtriggerin to start your batch job and you are done. no vsam, no db2, no job submit from cics.
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Regards, Butcher |
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| sumithar |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 5:51 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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| Mr Butcher wrote: |
| if you already have batch triggering in place, you could use that, just put the data you would like to pass to the batch job to mq queue, use batchtriggerin to start your batch job and you are done. no vsam, no db2, no job submit from cics. |
I actually didn't know I could trigger a batch job from MQ (only knew about triggering a CICS tran). Thanks for that. |
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| Mr Butcher |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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Padawan
Joined: 23 May 2005
Posts: 1716
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there is a batch trigger monitor supportpac for mq available... check the supportpac pages
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Regards, Butcher |
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| bruce2359 |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Poobah
Joined: 05 Jan 2008
Posts: 9470
Location: US: west coast, almost. Otherwise, enroute.
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| Quote: |
| I need to trigger a batch job from the CICS region and "pass" it some data. |
Do you needto trigger the CICS tran/application that submits the JCL? Or is the CICS thing already running when you need to submit the JCL?
If the CICS tran/app is already running, why involve MQ? If the CICS tran/app 'knows' what you need to pass to the batch job, can you include it as instream data in the JCL?
It seems to me that making the data-to-be-passed into an MQ message needlessly involves another subsystem - adds needless complication. If what you need to pass it is bigger than 80 characters (not suitable for instream), then a VSAM file would be a good place to pass the data.
_________________
I like deadlines. I like to wave as they pass by.
ב''ה
Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi, Lex Vivendi. As we Worship, So we Believe, So we Live. |
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| sumithar |
| Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:24 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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| bruce2359 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I need to trigger a batch job from the CICS region and "pass" it some data. |
Do you needto trigger the CICS tran/application that submits the JCL? Or is the CICS thing already running when you need to submit the JCL?
If the CICS tran/app is already running, why involve MQ? If the CICS tran/app 'knows' what you need to pass to the batch job, can you include it as instream data in the JCL?
It seems to me that making the data-to-be-passed into an MQ message needlessly involves another subsystem - adds needless complication. If what you need to pass it is bigger than 80 characters (not suitable for instream), then a VSAM file would be a good place to pass the data. |
Bruce,
Thanks- you have kind of said what I wanted to hear  . Especially that part of MQ being an additional subsystem. We are trying to set up some MQ best practices and this was one of the questions that came up- the usage of MQ to trigger batch jobs from CICS and the reverse. I was recommending using available z/OS techniques
Thanks! |
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| okearl |
| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 5:03 am Post subject: |
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Newbie
Joined: 03 Oct 2008
Posts: 2
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MQ Triggering transactions from batch is a popular method to
"START" transactions, but requires a higher degree of complexity
if you need to fully "INTERACT" with transactions and/or navigate
multiple 3270 screens from your batch programs.
Suggest you perform a google search on batch cics |
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| okearl |
| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 5:05 am Post subject: |
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Newbie
Joined: 03 Oct 2008
Posts: 2
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| sumithar |
| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:17 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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Thanks for those links. I will check them out |
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| zhanghz |
| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 2:16 am Post subject: |
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Disciple
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 186
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adding MQ will not only make your programs more complex but also cost you more.. 
anyway, why use MQ if you already have ways of triggering batch programs from online and vice versa? i don't see the need to use MQ when the programs and data are on the same machine. |
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| sumithar |
| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:12 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 13 Jun 2008
Posts: 47
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| zhanghz wrote: |
adding MQ will not only make your programs more complex but also cost you more..
anyway, why use MQ if you already have ways of triggering batch programs from online and vice versa? i don't see the need to use MQ when the programs and data are on the same machine. |
Zhang,
As I said in one of my earlier posts that is kind of the point I am trying to make at work. I have been stressing that MQ is a communication mechanism for disparate/different systems.
Thanks for corroborating!
It's still good to become aware of options, I guess
Rgds |
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