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| max power |
 Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:40 am Post subject: Broker Database not running |
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Apprentice
Joined: 06 Sep 2007
Posts: 31
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I'm having a blonde moment.....
What happens to running message flows if the broker database is to shutdown?
I'm thinking that everything will keep running until such time something needs to be changed within the Broker but am I thinking right?  |
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| jefflowrey |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:45 am Post subject: |
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Grand Poobah
Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 19981
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I think demons fly out of your nose.
Which is to say... I don't think it's specified anywhere what happens in the documentation, and I think that one shouldn't treat such a condition as anything other than an outage.
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I am *not* the model of the modern major general. |
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| max power |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:50 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 06 Sep 2007
Posts: 31
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I wish that demons did fly out of my nose as that might be less painful than this headache I've got. 
We will definitely treat this as a major outage, I just wondered what happened to the message flows until we sorted out the problem. Especially if this were to happen overnight. |
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:50 am Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| jefflowrey wrote: |
| I think demons fly out of your nose. |
I hate it when that happens. Especially in the office.
I just tried it on the wind-up broker on my laptop and it crashed. These two events may be connected, but it's hard to tell. My laptop has moods.
I'd try and avoid the situation personally.
_________________
Honesty is the best policy.
Insanity is the best defence. |
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| jefflowrey |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:54 am Post subject: |
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Grand Poobah
Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 19981
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| max power wrote: |
| I wish that demons did fly out of my nose as that might be less painful than this headache I've got. |
Depends on the size of the demon, doesn't it? I believe that the size of the demons in question is undefined.
| max power wrote: |
| Especially if this were to happen overnight. |
In a reasonably run enterprise, I would expect that the initial result of a database shutting down would be that a number of people received messages alerting them to that fact. Regardless of the time of day, if that is what the Service Level Agreements specify. And not in the middle of the night otherwise.
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| max power |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:58 am Post subject: |
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Apprentice
Joined: 06 Sep 2007
Posts: 31
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I'd hope that the DB team would resolve the problem within minutes but alas, that is seldom the case. Especially when they are raised from their slumber.
Looks like I'll have to create another test broker and try this out. |
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| jefflowrey |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:12 am Post subject: |
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Grand Poobah
Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 19981
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| max power wrote: |
I'd hope that the DB team would resolve the problem within minutes but alas, that is seldom the case. Especially when they are raised from their slumber.
Looks like I'll have to create another test broker and try this out. |
It's not clear that it should matter how long it takes them to resolve it.
If there's a clear definition of when the problem with the database started, it should be clear that the Broker is suffering an outage starting at that same time.
The other problem is - that the use of the database by the Broker depends quite a lot on what your flows are doing - from what I understand. So you may only see "issues" with certain execution groups, because some flow in them happened to hit a point that required the Broker DB.
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:15 am Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| jefflowrey wrote: |
| The other problem is - that the use of the database by the Broker depends quite a lot on what your flows are doing - from what I understand. So you may only see "issues" with certain execution groups, because some flow in them happened to hit a point that required the Broker DB. |
I certainly wouldn't take my improvised test results as gospel. My broker's been known to crash because the wind's changed unexpectedly. And demons coming out of my nose just means there's another impromptu design meeting I didn't know about in advance.
My laptop's been known to crash for similar reasons. So I wasn't starting from a position of known stability.
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| mqmatt |
| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:21 am Post subject: |
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Grand Master
Joined: 04 Aug 2004
Posts: 1213
Location: Hursley, UK
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WHat happens may also depend on what version of broker you're running. Prior to v6, your broker would probably crash if the database came down.
In v6, the broker is usually able to recover from resource failures such as this. |
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